>> funding for "to the contrary" provided by: the cornell douglas foundation committed to encouraging stewardship of the environment, land conservation, watershed protection and eliminating harmful chemicals. additional funding provided by: the colcom foundation. the wallace genetic foundation and by the charles a. frueauff foundation. >> this week on "to the contrary" ictra, go ctronl in ame following the newtown, ticut massacre. then, a look back at 2012 and ahead to the new year.

hello, i'm bonnie erbe. not feeling too well but still standing. welcome to "to the contrary," a discussion of news and social trends from diverse perspectives. up first, more guns or fewer guns? gun control advocates hope to see a federal ban reinstated on assault weapons following the unspeakable massacre of 20 children and six adults last week in connecticut. but gun advocates are pitching new state laws that allow teachers to carry concealed weapons to school, and one state, virginia, is considering a bill to require teachers to carry weapons to work. president obama promised to make gun control a central issue for his next term.

vice president joe biden is leading the administration effort to limit gun violence. early next month biden will deliver a set of specific legislative proposals for dollars tightening gun laws. so, congresswoman norton are guns in schools the answer? >> oh, bonnie. our country is in for another failing grade on guns if our best answer is guns in the schools. our best answer is to new town. >> i own guns. i'm generally skeptical of gun control but i'm not sure i'm ready to turn all american schools in to armed camps. >> absolutely not. in china the same day as newtown shooting there was man with a knife that entered a school. nobody was killed. this seems to imply the opposite. that guns out of schools is actual answer. >> i think guns in the hands of the right people or right person could be part of the answer to what we saw here.

i don't think there's one size answer fits all or just one answer that will address this. something we have to consider. >> it does -- the newtown massacre really change things are we going to see action in congress, on gun control? >> i think it did change things. whether we will be able to attract enough republicans, republicans even ready to take your economy down so i wouldn't be surprised if they did the same here as they have done to colorado imbibe and wisconsin and dozens of similar massacres. but i do think the country has changed. and i think it's time for people to tell these members who have been imprisoned by the nra to let your member go. >> i wish there was a simple answer. if i really believe that if you

ban a certain type of weapon, i don't like to call them assault weapons i'd call them semi automatic rifles. but if i thought that would work, maybe i would be open to it but the fact is we had the ban in effect for ten years, and the particular killings we've seen recently would probably not have been solved even if that bad had been in affect. even the new law would grandfather certain weapons in and i just don't think there is a simple answer. i think this is a complicated problem, guns is part of it. but so is our culture of violence and so is mental illness. >> i think nasa good news here that we'll have a debate. we'll have a discussion, because everyone is right when they say it's tragedy that this had happened again. not the first incident in this country or other parts of the world, what are we going to do to address it. i think it will be real shame if people use this race political opportunity to push an agenda they have always had, gun control being an example. try to use the emotion of the

nation right now to address it. i will tell you i'm encouraged by some of the polling i've seen on this, the american public seems to be taking a very hard look at it you, saying, you what, we should maybe have stricter gun laws but one says only about 28% thought that would have fixed the issue here. most of them think addressing the mental health issue in addition to violence and video games are also part of it. there's a lot to debate but i think we have to be very careful that we don't blame one party or the other if we're really going to have a sane, thoughtful and helpful discussion to try to prevent things like this in the future. >> what do you think needs to be done? >> i think right now we have public opinion very much on our side and i think that's because of the frequency of the shooting we've seen. there is representative gabby giffords last year, the movie theater. now we're in to kindergarten classrooms. >> two multiple shootings since the newtown shooting. >> there has. but we also should go back to the second amendment itself.

and take a look at what the framers of the constitution were thinking. if you read the text that seems to imply that they meant guns to be just owned by militias for the purpose of safeguarding what they call a free state. looking back at that language it doesn't seem like kind of things happening now is what they had in mind at all. >> but the problem that we have had supreme court decision that pretty much upheld the idea that people do have an individual right to own guns. i am actually much more comfortable with limiting the magazines that are available. than i am with certain types of weapons, we already outlaw automatic weapons. they have been ought ought lawed for many years. the idea that you need 30 round clip or 50 round clip or whatever, that to me seems to be a more fruitful area to look at because it is hard i think to make the case that a sportsman or a hunter needs that many

rounds of ammunition. that is one of the problems in these cases is that there is no break in this shooting that allows an adult or someone else to step in and to stop the bloodshed because you have so many rounds of ammunition. >> the assault weapon ban had where it the ban on magazines or clips of more than ten bullets. look at this man. >> i will also tell you that i talked to a friend this week which is a gun owner and hunter he was telling me in the black market they just take -- if limit it to ten clips there are people who will make a living out of taking ten of them putting them together. >> you know what, as we've said around this table today with the many different remedies that are needed for mammoth problems in our society, you will find huge exceptions to every single

remedy. if that becomes reason for doing something then shame on us. yes, we ought to limit the magazines, let's start there. we can't say because some will go outside of the law, we shouldn't have the law. some will steal. so we shouldn't have a law against stealing. then we should do something about the gun show loophole which is misnamed, because what really is to keep from you going around whatever law you pass and simply selling a gun, as it turns out at gun shows, many guns without any background checks. imagine with this perhaps troubled man what that would mean to many out there, of course this is how criminals get their guns. >> you know, i wonder if -- even if for some people would like to see ban on all weapons of all sorts you just check in at a

hunting club, borrow a rifle when you want to go hunting which would never happen in this country. because of the proliferation of weapons is so widespread there are more weapons than people in this country since adam lanza his assault the ar-15 which is similar to the rifle he used, they're out of stock now everywhere. everybody is running out to get one because they're afraid they're going to be illegal. could you ever get a grip on the number of weapons out there. >> i think that's almost impossible. you are right, you'd have to confiscate those european countries that have in fact put in to affect bans, many have then gone out confiscated guns, that's not going to happen in america. i'm sorry, it's not. >> there is plenty of evidence to look at here. when there's -- not study that tells you that banning guns

decreases suicide or mass murders, just not. and center for disease control and others have looked for those they can't get them. the fact is when you have -- >> the cdc is not allowed to collect information -- on weapons as a -- when studies have been done on behalf of cdc other arms of the federal government none of them show that taking guns out decreases suicide or these other things. we have to look at the fact also that when you allow guns in to communities mining whether it's concealed weapon or people allowed to have gun in their home you see usually a crime rate drop. does all crime stop? >> there's no causation here. >> the fact is people want to have the right to defend themselves and i think it's wrong, whether you agree with the nra statement on this or not i think it's worth considering that it's true, when everybody knees if i walk in to that venue whether it's a school, it's a church, it's a private business, whatever it is, a home because

guns are banned. that nobody in there is going to have what i have -- >> most guns that are in the home or in private hands are used more often for suicide and shooting by accident a neighbor or family member than -- >> that is not dash. >> can i ask to you listen to me on this. that's a fact. that has been shown. i am not here arguing therefore, when you put that it -- well, taking all guns away would only do, no one is advocating taking all guns away. as you said, guns are out of control. there are 300 million of them in the society now. all you can do now is to say how can you begin to take a step back. then test that. see if that works. and if not try something else. what we have not done since 2004 when assault weapon ban lapse

is, nothing. that is inexcusable after 20 children were massacred. >> all right. let us know what you think. please follow me on twitter @bonnieerbe. and now our annual look back at the year that was. the women and women's issues that made headlines in 2012. >> 2012 was the year of the so-called war on women. women's reproductive rights and birth control exploded as major political issues with measurable impact on not only the presidential race but congressional races as well. a hearing on birth control versus religious liberty set the stage when a house oversight committee hearing featured an all-male panel early in the year. the republican chair barred testimony from anyone supporting women's access to birth control.

that prompted new york democrat carolyn maloney and our own eleanor holmes norton to storm out in protest. >> religion does not trip the right. you try to find an accommodation when you have two rights crashing. the reproductive rights of women and the religious rights of religious institutions. >> angry for being silenced house democratic leaders held their own hearing on contraception coverage. the hearing featured one witness. sandra fluke was a law student at georgetown university. she had lobbied her school to include contraception coverage for students in its health insurance policy. fluke's testimony earned her a prime spot on the podium at the democratic convention. she was one of many women highlighted at both the democratic and republican conventions. >> it's an exciting time to be a

woman. and i want to go out there and celebrate it. and continue to see what women can do in this country. >> while jobs and the economy continued to be issue number one, the prickly issue of abortion and contraceptive rights detonated time and again. richard mourdock, the gop senate candidate in indiana talked about rape and pregnancy during a debate. >> god intended the pregnancy >> i think even when life begins in that horrible situation of rape that it is something that god intended to happen. >> and freshman house republican joe walsh of illinois insisted there is no such thing as an abortion to protect a woman's life or health due to "advances in science and technology." and missouri rep. todd akin's infamous remark about women's bodies shutting down to prevent pregnancy in cases of so-called "legitimate rape." stunned lots of women voters.

as a result many voters told pollsters women's rights were a concern. in the end the women's vote went solidly for president obama as opposed to gop challenger mitt romney. and none of the three men who made strange statements about women's bodies won their races. on capitol hill the election brought the total number of women in the senate to 20, 16 democrats and four republicans, and 78 women in the house, 58 democrats, 20 republicans. as budget negotiations continued to loom, women were asked whether having equal female representation in congress would have changed things. >> we would have dealt with that. it's critical to the country. we need to provide certainty for businesses for our families. so they will know what they're looking at over the next year and again as women i think we tend to be consensus builders, we like to get lots of inbuilt then work together to get things done.

>> marriage equality laws passed during the election took effect in washington state and maryland as same sex couples lined up to formalize their unions. now the issue goes to the supreme court. earlier in the year the court affirmed the legality of obamacare, also known as the patient protection and affordable care act. with that 5-4 decision and the re-election of president obama states are now working towards putting the law into effect. and even before president obama is sworn into office the 2016 rumor mill has begun - will she or won't she run? no one knows for sure. we do know hillary clinton says she's leaving the high wire act of politics. she's travelled nearly one million miles and visited at least 120 countries. she's met with world leaders as well as women's groups to work toward women's empowerment. now she says she needs some down

time. >> i think after 20 years it will be 20 years of being on the high wire of american politics and all of the challenges that come with that it would be probably good idea to just find out how tired i am. >> in response to alarming statistics about sexual assaults in the military, the pentagon announced new initiatives to prevent the crimes and help victims. america nuns continue to battle with theco vatican, say the nuns have grown prelates say the nuns have grown too secular and liberal while abandoning traditional doctrine. on the corporate front, 19 women now head fortune 500 companies. joining the list was marissa mayer who made headlines for taking over yahoo. she then announced she was six months pregnant. mayer released her son's name macallister on twitter.

she took a short break and returned to work. and after years of battling the male only augusta national golf club, the home of the masters now has green jackets for women. former secretary of state condoleeza rice and south carolina financier darla moore are the first female members since 1932. linda, what do you think was the biggest women's story of 2012? >> i do think the women's role and women's vote in the 2012 election is the big story. you had a huge gap an 18% gap between president obama's female vote and mitt romney's. but more importantly it's not just that the women are much larger part of the electorate, 54%, but that married women have declined, republicans still do relatively well with married women but there are fewer and fewer of those women in america because marriage is in decline. >> mitt romney actually won the white married women vote. >> that's right.

>> republicans always win the white married women's vote, although we saw considerable numbers of women married women vote for president obama. actually i think the biggest women's story of the year is why women saw to it that a black man had a second term as president of the united states. i think i'm agreeing with linda. i don't think anybody will ever take the women's vote for granted again, just as they won't take hispanic vote for granted again. it may be easier, particularly since have been republicans who have understood that there are to be a balanced approach to immigration, may be easier to get back a little bit. i don't know how -- when you consider wearing this that abortion and contraception played in this election, i don't know how they are going to get back with women. >> this was my favorite year

2012, i've had better years. but i think the comments that you make are certainly play to what was the big story. i will say, i think for all the dollars and political attacks that came from the left on this war on women. i found it interesting that only about 36 to 28% of women actually thought that was a significant issue. that gives me hope. other reason -- >> 39% in battleground state polling. >> when you -- >> well, there was a lot of attack. a lot of women didn't fall for it. the fact is, 500,000 fewer women working today under barack obama's reign and 3.5 million in poverty. those aren't good numbers. i hope he turns it around in the next four years. i have less hope that's going to happen based on what he puts forward. i think women will be open to new ideas that are going to give them opportunity to succeed and i think that means anybody's got a good idea can convince them of it has chance of winning them

back. >> the biggest story of 2012 i'm going to have to say, young weep being brave. we saw sandra fluke who became national celebrity for the millennial generation. and then we saw all the way in pakistan, milala who was shot by the taliban because she said i'm going to get an education, i'm not afraid of anything. i think the next generation of women is really being inspired by this bravery. the hope is that they will take it to the next level and follow in the footsteps of other great women running for congress. >> do you happen to know how milala is doing? >> i heard she's recovering that she's on the road. >> fully? >> i am not sure. >> what was it that caused the galvin sakes? was it young women feeling that their reproductive rights were being threatened? >> i think it certainly was. most of the decision makers in

office, very few of them are women of reproductive age. you also saw i think young women fully awakening in 2010 when health care reform was being passed we saw how reproductive rights was used as a bargaining chip. it didn't fight too hard then as things kept progressing and progressing, you had a lot of republican congressmen making this ridiculous statement. then all came to fruition with sandra when she took the stage. >> i have to disagree with that. i don't think reproductive rights were in fact in any way being threatened. i do think that the three republicans that made ridiculous statement did great harm to their party, did great harm to the top of their ticket. >> what are republicans going back down, what are republicans going to do to try to win

back -- >> that economic issues, i was surprised. a lot of people were surprised. we had a terrible economy. a president who presided over a terrible economy. yet he won re-election. i do think -- >> pollsters did show that americans were smart enough to give president credit for having inherited an even worse situation. >> but he didn't -- >> we were on the brink of bankruptcy. >> yes. >> we weren't on the brink of bankruptcy. we had looming crisis in our financial industry. >> worst since the great depression. they blamed it on bush as history will do. they didn't blame him for -- >> except that it is the slowest recovery we have essentially ever had. we did not recover the way we normally recover. president reagan, whom i worked for, had higher unemployment than barack obama. he had a confluence of really --

>> high interest rates. high inflation. high unemployment. it was a worse economy in certain respects. but because of his policy changes the country in fact bounced back. i am surprised that people did want to give barack obama a second chance. i think if the republicans had fielded somebody who actually told us what he was going to do and what he believed in why he should be president. we would not be having -- >> this is interesting. because around this table even, over and over again everywhere, republicans said, particularly republican women who defended mitt romney said, no. women care about the economy. if you disaggregate the economy and issues on the table and everybody was satisfied with the economy there is no way that you will not come away contraception, abortion, rights that people thought they had.

if you want to get people mad, if you want to really get people out take away something they thought was safe. that's what women thought. they thought that our mothers didn't even have to worry about contraception. when they were young women they won 'boring. that is an issue that has not been on my agenda. they put it on their agenda and it was a solidifying because the economy that you all claim was going to do it, didn't. >> that will have to be it for this edition. that's it for this edition of "to the contrary." we didn't get to hillary. she will run. econtr follow me on twitter at tetr you age or thito ra, please join us next time. e

>>ng fdiun for "to the contrary" provided by: the cornell douglas foundation committed to encouraging stewardship of the environment, land conservation, watershed protection and eliminating harmful chemicals.di additional funding provided by: the colcomouonndati. the wallace genetic foundation and by the charles a. frueauff foundation. aor a copy of "to the contrary" please contact federal news service at 1-888-343-1940.